Taking Healthcare by Storm: Industry Insights with Alayna Click-Thomas

In this episode of Taking Healthcare by Storm, Quality Insights Medical Director Dr. Jean Storm speaks with Alayna Click-Thomas, MS, SHRM-SCP, GenZ Keynoter and Retention Strategist with Magnet Culture, and was named a 2024 USA Today Keynote Speaker to Follow.

Alayna discusses the unique challenges in healthcare retention, emphasizing the need for modern strategies that resonate with Gen Z employees. She highlights the importance of understanding employee expectations, effective feedback processes, and integrating technology smoothly while maintaining a human touch in patient care.

If you have any topics or guests you'd like to see on future episodes, reach out to us on our website.

The views and opinions expressed by the host and guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views, positions, or policies of Quality Insights. Publication number QI-012326-GK

Transcript

Welcome to "Taking Healthcare by Storm: Industry Insights," the podcast that delves into the captivating intersection of innovation, science, compassion, and care. 

In each episode, Quality Insights’ Medical Director Dr. Jean Storm will have the privilege of engaging with leading experts across diverse fields, including dieticians, pharmacists, and brave patients navigating their own healthcare journeys. 

Our mission is to bring you the best healthcare insights, drawing from the expertise of professionals across West Virginia, Pennsylvania and the nation.

Subscribe now, and together, we can take healthcare by storm.

Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Taking Healthcare by Storm. I am Dr. Jean Storm, the medical director of Quality Insights,  So I'm thrilled to be joined by Alayna. Click Thomas, M-S-S-H-R-M-S-C-P-A, nationally recognized Gen Z and retention strategist with magnet culture, named a 2024 keynote speaker to follow by USA today.

Alayna brings both professional expertise and the unique perspective of a Gen Z leader herself. She's helping organizations across. Industries, especially healthcare, a huge problem today, which is keeping good people working in your organization to rethink outdated retention strategies. Better understand the motivators of today's employees and build stronger, more adaptable teams for the future.

Alayna has been a university instructor, HR director, program manager, and now an author of Magnet culture's upcoming book on retention strategies. She's passionate about helping leaders break old paradigms and create environments where employees not only stay, but they thrive. Something. Again, I say. We all healthcare organizations  are looking for.

Alayna, thank you very much for joining us and welcome to the show. Thanks so much. I am so happy and excited for this conversation. We met at the West Virginia Healthcare Association Conference in Morgantown, West Virginia. As we were talking before we started recording. And I just was so impressed at your presence and your expertise in this area, and I think our listeners are going to really appreciate the tips and tricks that you can offer them.

Thanks so much. what a great start. I mean, I'm already smiling and very flattered. Thanks. Good healthcare. As I said, it's facing critical staffing shortages. So what are the unique retention challenges in healthcare compared to other industries and how do outdated strategies make the problem worse?

Yeah, they really do, don't they? Let's see. So I will say our magnet culture team loves healthcare. You said that we met at West Virginia Healthcare Association. 'cause about 75% of the business we do is in healthcare, specifically in the continuum of senior care and home care. So just, I know everyone's healthcare looks a little different and so I wanted to give that context.

Right. But what we've found it's not the sexiest industry out there.  Not everyone, not every applicant, or even everyone who's qualified is going to consider healthcare when looking for a job because of the way they've experienced it, the way it's been portrayed. And on top of that, you also see those who do like healthcare.

The ones who are like, yes, I wanna work in this space. We as employers can't compete with the more profitable industries down the street that  extra money comes in and now they can give out signing bonuses and raises all the time and all these extra perks. And so what this means, right? We've got maybe a smaller pool of candidates plus those who.

Want more than just a paycheck.  We have to work even harder to keep the people once we hire them.  Something that we say, so this is a retention challenge, right? Is our new hires are our flight risks. So they just got here, they just got to our organization. They don't have deep roots. They haven't made friends.

They don't, they're maybe not in love with the mission, vision values yet. They haven't seen them in action. They've only been here two weeks and so. we have to be really careful with these new hires. 'cause we just worked so hard to get them and now we wanna keep them. But where's the outdated strategy, right?

You said what outdated strategy makes the problem worse?  I think it's a lot of more so outdated thought that we hear from managers. So things that I have been told already in my career is  well, you should be grateful to work here.  So kind of saying instead of caring about a raise, like. A job well done here should be enough.

And that's very different than the thought process that I have as an employee.  Or  you should go above and beyond every day that you're here.  Okay? Well, I've got a friend of mine who says  well, I'm only gonna go above and beyond if you pay me more. And maybe the last one is this thought that it's all on the candidate, right?

 You come into an interview and we say, you don't get a second chance at a first impression. And we're saying, so if they come in with.  Clothes that we don't like during the interview, they're out. The same goes for the employer. We, as an employer, if this is true, we also don't get a second chance at a first impression.

And so we want to just rethinking instead of this idea that it's all on the applicant or the candidate. Actually it's on us too. What are the things that we're doing besides raises or whatever is out of our control to attract people?    you know, I say all that and I wanna, in case someone's listening and they're like, okay, wait a second.

So it sounds like I'm talking about a workforce that says me, me, me all the time. that's maybe the trend that we're seeing, but overall  we'll get more hopefully into this, but. It's really the job market and all of the options that are available that has created some of this mentality.  I mean, There really are a lot of competitors, a lot of jobs, especially for maybe more entry level folks.

 And so that's why we have to be mindful in healthcare, that we don't just say  this is the way healthcare is, this is how we do it, because our competitors are more than just other healthcare orgs. Yeah  I would agree. People are getting very creative about their maybe creative and open-minded about where their opportunities are.

  Yes, you are a Gen Z strategist. You bring a fresh lens into this environment. How do Gen Z employees expectations of work differ from previous generations? And what does that mean for healthcare organizations trying to stabilize their workforce? So in case someone is brand new to the generational conversation I have to say that it can be confusing when we're talking about like this alphabet soup of generations.

 Because there's no governing body that says here is the generation titles and when everyone was born and all the things. So you might get even some competing research that's off by a year or two.  So I'll say that we use the Bureau of Labor Statistics 'cause we like seeing the trends in the labor force.

 And Gen Z, you're talking about Gen Z. They were born 1997 to 2012. So here at the end of 2025, they're age 13 to 28. So just as you have an idea for who we're talking about, right? I've been one of the youngest team members, if not the youngest, in every single job I've had so far.  I'm still in my twenties, so just to write like  the math, maths  I often hear a lot of statements that are like since you're Gen Z or since you're this age, you must fill in the blank.

And it's, it takes a lot of  effort to not get defensive when someone tells me. Who I am and what I think and how I do things versus asks me,  Any of us would be in that boat. And so I think, just one note that I like to say on generations is it can be quite harmful when we use it to just perpetuate these assumptions, but it can be really helpful when we use it to start the conversation.

So everything that you guys hear me say, it's just starting the conversation and then go and talk to people in your life and see if this is true or not, and ask questions and get curious. Okay. But you asked me how, expectations are differing. at work, kind of this evolution of expectations. It's almost hard to say.

How are they similar? So maybe one of my favorite differences that I'm seeing, I tell people and managers that the obligation era is over. The obligation era is over. So what it used to be is that as an employee.  You would do it whatever your boss asked you to do, because you should, because that's how employer employee relationships work.

And if you didn't do that, it would be like insubordination and this, there was a lot more focus on  these rules and should do it. Now I'm not seeing loyalty for loyalty's sake anymore.  People aren't just staying because they should or doing the job because they should.  They're asking a lot of questions.

 They're trying to figure out if they can trust their leader, if they can trust that they're going to have this job in a year from now.  Because we've seen a lot of job shifts, reductions in force, things like that. So what I'm seeing now is that employees will still do it and actually they'll do it even better if they understand why  and maybe even what's in it for me now.

I hear it. I can hear the difference. When you have, you're used to someone just saying, yep, I've got that boss. Versus now you've got someone saying  why should I do that? Okay. Of course that's going to be frustrating. It truly, it's like the key to motivating your people and getting the best performance.

When you can help them understand why this matters and you understand what matters to your people, it will help you motivate them. Um. So that's, I think, maybe one of the biggest that I'm seeing shifts. And, And if we have more time, I'll share even more too.  Yeah. And I love it. I'm Gen X, so I hear that, that what's in it for me mentality and I see my, kind of.

 Opinion. Say  I don't know about that   I'm, I think we need to be open-minded, right? So why does it matter for patient care and how can leaders adapt to this? What's in it for me mentality? What we know about even change management principles, when people are bought in, changes go smoother.

And I think the same is true healthcare. We, every single job is different every single day, and every single job is different than the day before. And so when people are bought in and when they understand why it matters, when they care about what they do, they're going to do a better job. So it's going to lead to better patient care.

And there's an in-between here. I think the, what's in it for me, we answer with the employer kind of mutually beneficial situation here. We're not just saying  well, here's everything that's in it for the employee. It's also part of the answer to this would be, Hey, then we can do our jobs better. We can take care of our people better.

So to give a non-healthcare example. You had mentioned earlier that I teach and so I teach an Intro to Human Resources class. My background is all HR and I asked  my, my group of 18 to 21-year-old college students what they wanted from a future job. And I really thought that they were gonna say money or flexibility.

And I'm so glad that I asked instead of operating off of assumptions, because instead they overwhelmingly shared that what they care about most is being valued and appreciated for their contributions. If they go above and beyond, they're waiting for that gold star to go with it. And so my students were teaching me  as their professor, that the key to getting their best work is to recognize their job well done and all the progress along the way.

That didn't just mean in the form of a grade, which I can give them, or it what an employer could give them, right? Is money. No, it actually was the simple thumbs up. You've got this micro feedback along the way. Okay, so if you're a leader that you were used to this kind of obligation way of doing things, maybe even a punitive approach, right?

Like If you do that one more time, you're gonna get written up, you're gonna lose your job. Kind of That fear based. I want you to recalibrate, try so hard. I know it's a lot of work to think differently because what we're finding with, especially this emerging workforce, a lot of Gen Z is positive reinforcement is more effective in motivating them.

Actually, this is true for not just this age, but we see it most with them because they bring their whole selves. They'll tell you, people repeat what is rewarded. So even a simple thank you for someone coming to their job on time, that's going to go a long way because we have people on our teams  who don't show up on time, or they show up and they're not doing a great job, or they show up physically and they're not there mentally in the job, right?

So even though it might feel like, quote the bare minimum to show up on time and do your job. That's actually not what we're seeing in our workforce.  A lot of people aren't even needing that bare minimum. So let's praise not just our highest performers, but also those who are doing the job well. And based on what my students taught me, that's the key to get them to actually now go and do even more work work even harder.

There's only benefits I really think, to the employer to understand. This what's in it for me mentality. And then once you build that trust, yes, let's take it a step further and let's help coach a bit and maybe even share, hey, inside scoop the way that you're asking questions, the way that you say that  it's not coming across the best on the team, but we have to build trust before we can get to that piece.

I love that answer so much. Yes. For someone who has mentored and maybe been in charge of individuals who are Gen Z  and how I have. Teenagers.  My children are Gen ZI, I think that it's really so interesting and I think   as a Gen Xer and like boomers, I think we have this idea that like I was told what I was doing wrong and I stopped doing that.

 Right?  And think  that's gonna work for everyone. It doesn't work for everyone, and that's not bad. That is just how it is. And we want to be able to communicate effectively and motivate effectively the individuals that we come in contact with. So I  I love that.  I think that's, it's true.

I it, so talking about feedback, constructive key feedback is critical in healthcare. It's often delivered in rushed, high stress environments. I know as a young physician I was given a whole lot of feedback because that's what happens when you're new in medicine and some was pretty harsh. What can leaders do to create a feedback culture that Gen Z receives well while also maintaining patient safety and accountability?

Yeah, so you know, that feedback's only effective. It's if it's received and then it changes behavior, right? So again, that's gotta be our goal here. But what I said earlier is it does take more time to build that trust. And so it has to, we have to focus so much on the relationship and building that trust.

With especially Gen Z you said patient safety, so I do have to say safety is number one. So if, any of you find that something that you're doing is getting in the way of patient safety, that's your top priority, right? We might not have time to build a relationship and build all the trust. Right now we have to address that safety first.

But for everything else. It's okay if it takes more time.  We don't change our patterns and behaviors overnight.  Right. So we can't expect employees to do the same well. So I think first thing is where and how are you giving this feedback?  It creates quite a bad impression when someone who doesn't work here sees us and employees.

Treat each other poorly, right? So we know  I'm gonna take senior care for an example, right? So you're in the hallways of the community  or in a hospital setting, right? You're in the hallways and you've got people with the badges on, with the uniform on that are not talking nicely about patients  about each other.

And maybe even, I have overheard plenty of leaders.  Yell feedback in the hallway, right? So like it's a raised voice conversation. Okay? So all of these things, that's maybe not the time and place and way to give feedback because the perception is how we treat each other is how we're going to be treating residents patients.

So, One, make sure you're in the right place. The second is we can't be selective about feedback. We're never going to have the culture that we need and see the behavior change if we allow certain staff, maybe more existing tenured staff to be exempt from the same feedback and rules that we're giving to all of our new hires.

And this is so much easier said than done. I have been in an HR director position, and I know that there's. There's a lot more behind the scenes that happens when it comes to  the politics of the workplace, But I will say. I left one of my previous jobs solely because of one person.

She was exempt from every rule in the workplace. She was creating a subculture where anyone who was under 10 years with the company was not valuable. We didn't know we were talking about. And all it takes is one person. So just like how safety is number one. The second thing is that if you have.

A person on your team who is creating a culture or, maybe showing behavior that isn't appropriate. Like you have to address that. We're not gonna get the whole team together and say, Hey, so we just wanna remind everyone that we need to be kind to one another.  No, the team's not gonna receive that at all if they believe that it's just one person and that you should be handling that one-on-one.

But to get to feedback with Gen Z, this is my feedback formula.  Our magnet culture, one that we like to use. So if you're a leader, that kind of avoids feedback. I get it. It's hard  uh, especially the constructive type. Here's what I encourage you to do. Three steps. Notice, explain why, and make a request, all with empathy and accountability balanced in there.

So what this could look like is. Hey, I noticed that over the last several shifts, you have been coming in at 8 0 5 when your shift starts at eight o'clock.  it's really important for us, we're explaining why now. It's really important for us that we can.

Have a, smooth switching over of talent during shifts that we have good patient care during that time. So my request is that you can get here at maybe 7 55 for your eight o'clock shift. How does that sound? What barriers are getting in the way? And  we're being curious here and saying  that, you know, it's the empathy, accountability, curiosity,  I have been using this with a lot of people my age, and it is the most effective  because it becomes a two-way conversation rather than just giving feedback one way.  And it also, instead of being a 30 second conversation, maybe we're at more of a five minute conversation, but that time spent now.

Really pays off later because you make sure that everyone's on the same page and they understand why it matters. So again, it's the what's in it for me, making sure that you always explain why in feedback, you're going to have a lot more success. That is just fantastic. I just was saying I wrote that down notice, explain why make a request.

And I love I'm a huge fan of curiosity. My, my favorite cartoon character, curious George, and I love that. Yes. I feel like he needs to be like a have a prominent place in healthcare. So I think that this just in following that simple guideline will make a huge difference in healthcare, giving feedback.

 And I, I wanna say one more thing, right? So  why as a leader, should you take the time to do this? Okay. One, the behavior is gonna change. More effectively, faster,   you might say, well, if I had known that was an issue, I could have helped before we got to the point where now someone's putting in their resignation. So even though staff may leave for reasons outside of your control. Simply listening and understanding maybe why they can't get this thing done that you ask them to do.

You might say, oh, easy.  I can fix that. Or you might build trust by saying, gosh, that does sound like a big barrier. I cannot fix that right now, but I can offer you some more support. What support might you need from me? So this is now making this team stronger as well. It's not just benefiting the employee again.

Yeah. Yeah. That's great.  Just great tools. I just wanted to touch briefly talk a little bit briefly about ai. We know that healthcare is rapidly adopting ai, telehealth digital tools. How does Gen Z's comfort with technology present opportunities or challenges in preparing them for roles in a high tech, high touch environment?

I think that we, I like to call Gen Z, the on demand generation because we grew up with on demand access to information and products and all the things. Some other people call Gen Z digital natives because we don't know a working world without smartphones. Specifically. The working world piece is key, right?

So we're used to a lot, you say high tech, high touch, but also high speed in this space.  Overall, there's a lot more comfort with technology and even expectation that it's being used.  But we also can't assume that anyone, based on their age, has a certain set of skills, right? So we do still need to be ready to train on technology and also teach that balance with human interaction.

So talk about the ai, everyone, and their mom is talking about the flip side, which is AI versus the human touch side. I might say I heard this  I forget who said it.  So I'm not gonna be able to cite them, but. An expert in this space was talking about some research he's doing on the decline in bedside manner.

That's happening potentially as a result of the increase in technology and ai. Right? So we're seeing less eye contact from our healthcare providers. We're seeing a lot more looking at computer screens. We're seeing a lot more of instead of asking one another questions  you should just look at the notes, but maybe the notes didn't have every piece of nuance in them.

 You know, There's just a lot there. So.  The opportunity is that you've got a group who's very comfortable with technology, rapidly changing as it has my whole life growing up in different ways. But the challenges is potentially a dependence  or only building a skillset in the technology space.

We'll need to offset that with training and coaching on the human element as well. Yeah, I would agree. And I love how you said it doesn't matter the age, we need to do appropriate training on technology. Yes, a hundred percent. Yes. Agree. Last question. Okay. If you could redesign  this is a big one.

If you could redesign workforce strategy in healthcare from the ground up. What bold moves would you recommend leaders take today to build sustainable engaged teams for the future? Because  that's what everyone is looking for. Ooh, okay. Let's see.  The workforce has evolved very dramatically over the last 10 years.

So what we know from the labor force, we've got Boomers, gen Xers, millennials and Gen Zs all working together. Plus we have traditionalists  that oldest generation are those who we serve. Part of this evolution so quickly has to do with the technology, the pace of change. But if, I could say what bold moves.

Be curious. I love that you said you love curiosity uh, Dr. Storm, but be curious and reduce judgment. Okay.  I promise  it's bold and it's hard to do because what's happening is our lack of understanding or even caring about those we work with, it's led to more conflict. And instead of these us versus them fires on our team, if we could step back and say  why is that person like that?

Why do they show up to work that way? Then we're not going to have as much of that conflict and we can move forward together faster. We also the way that  unless it's different in some environments, most of us gain more exposure and experience the longer we are working, right? So we learn more about the nuance in this environment and this unique scenario that we never thought we'd encounter.

 We encountered that. 'cause I've been here for 10, 15, 20, 25 years. Well, Your newest hires, especially your youngest hires, they still need to gain that exposure and experience. But whenever we go to that judgment place of well, they should just know how to do it, or why can't they do it this exact way?

Okay. Well, I. How should they know the exact way to do it? You just have more experience than they do.  We have to be careful not to come at that from maybe this condescending, like I am a wise sage and you are my young student. Like in the workplace, a lot of times we're peers with people who are different ages than us.

So how do we build sustainable, engaged teams? We start with curiosity and reducing judgment. If we're not understanding questions to better understand the unique perspectives of every single person on our team, then we are going to become further disconnected and we will be the leader that an employee says  they don't understand me.

Now I'm gonna go find a leader who does understand me.  Curiosity is really going to give us the insights that we need on what matters to this person. How do we motivate them? How do we become more attractive to hire people? But if we operate off of assumption, then we are losing to the leaders and organizations who are getting curious and even saying  it's worth the investment of time or money or effort to adjust to better meet the needs of the people in front of me.

I'm just gonna say you're speaking my language.  I have, obviously, we talked a lot about curiosity, but operating from assumption, right?  I like that. Is that I understand why they're not doing their job. I understand how to get people in the door. I like you just instead of really being curious and trying to  discover and Yeah, like we, I feel like that.

That assumption piece. People don't realize how much they live their life through assumption. It doesn't do us any favors. Yeah. This is my daily reminder. I need a daily reminder. Okay, Alayna, stop assuming so much because I do it every single day, even though I'm telling you we shouldn't do that. Right.

 That's also something that leaders should be doing is saying, okay, where am I not taking my own advice here? Because we also have to grow every single day. Yeah, agree.  If people want to find out more about you, I know you're a keynote speaker, so people might want you for their conference.

How can they find out more about you? Yes, thanks for asking. Magnet culture.com, M-A-G-N-E-T, magnet culture.com. You're gonna find  information about me speaking also, if you want more insights on. The generational side of generation and retention. That's really our sweet spot.  I've got some blogs out there all linked to the website as well as even a little, I call it a mini book full of more stories that I couldn't share today.

So all of that you can find there.  Y'all can connect with me on LinkedIn as well  under Alayna, click Thomas. And  yeah, I think everything that you need is gonna be on that website. It'll link you to our YouTube and all sorts of things. Awesome. Alayna, click Thomas. I love this conversation. I hope that our listeners got a lot out of it as well, so thank you very much.

Thank you. 

Thank you for tuning in to Taking Healthcare by Storm: Industry Insights with Quality Insights Medical Director Dr. Jean Storm. We hope that you enjoyed this episode. If you found value in what you heard, please consider subscribing to our podcast on your favorite platform.

If you have any topics or guests you'd like to see on future episodes, you can reach out to us on our website. We would love to hear from you.

So, until next time, stay curious, stay compassionate, and keep taking healthcare by storm.